Episode Transcript
Speaker 1 00:00:06 Welcome to teaming up conversations, the podcast. I'm your host Simon better. I believe that one of the most satisfying and rewarding moments in life is belonging to a trusted team and achieving something unique together. Thank you for joining our dialogue, how to build lead and be part of an inspired team and community.
Speaker 1 00:00:40 I am honored to speak to Jennifer Lewis about the importance of collaboration demonstrating that group efforts result in powerful, inspiring creation. Jennifer is the principal and founder of Lu ed studio architects in San Diego, California, a collaborative studio practicing at the intersection of architecture, art, and design. Jennifer grew up in Montreal. Canada received her master of design degree at Harvard UN university graduate school of design. She's an I AA international academy of architects professor and has the academic position of lecture at Stanford university. Teaching architecture at the school of engineering. Jennifer is best known for a collaborative design process to best summarize her creative philosophy. I quote from her website. We believe that architecture is a conversation that exceptional design happens through inquisitive exchange between client and architect, building and landscape among teams, makers, and thinkers. Conversation holds the power to transform, to surpass expectation. It's a moment of moving through a doorway over a threshold from one space into another. When sensation, memory, tone, minds, cultures, and cells meet. This is how we build things that matter. Please enjoy this fascinating and wide ranging conversation with designer architect and artist, Jennifer Lu. Jennifer. It is so exciting to be with you. I look forward to our conversations,
Speaker 2 00:02:22 Simon, wonderful to be with you too. I can't say that I have more passion for teaming up. Then I do this very moment. So this is the perfect time for us to talk.
Speaker 1 00:02:35 Yes, we have known each other for many years. We have done some work together. And one thing I'm really impressed is about your architecture, your design, your creative process is how you collaborate. You got this collaborative spirit. Can you talk a little bit about that philosophy and how you go about bringing different ideas into your creative process?
Speaker 2 00:03:00 Mm-hmm <affirmative> I think the philosophy comes from a number of places and I've been thinking about this because it's so natural for me now, but you're right. Where did it come from? And essentially number one, I would say it's observing family practice. So my father was a textile designer person in Liberty of London. And I watched how that process of producing textiles was such a collaborative effort of many people. I remember being impressed by that in this communal spirit of togetherness was so powerful to me. And then the architectural education is all about collaboration between students. And I think, although we didn't know it at the time, it prepared us for the profession of needing and having to work frankly, with others. Because each project we do could take at least 20 to 30 people to execute. So immediately you're put in this position where collaboration is almost essential.
Speaker 2 00:04:06 As I have always said, there is no one author for an architecture project. And so this notion of working together and interweaving your talents is really critical. But then I think it was only when I began building truly building in my community that I discovered the notion of collaboration with craft as well. So this idea of working with craftspeople to learn from them, to dialogue with them, as you were building something, to have them bring their talent to the table with equal status and power and voice, it was just so refreshing and educational for me that I became obsessed.
Speaker 1 00:04:52 How do you bring those different creative people together? What's the criterias it is intuitive. Is it logical? It's a combination.
Speaker 2 00:05:03 Mm-hmm <affirmative> well, there's always a combination of logic and intuitive, poetic response in the architecture projects at least four hours. And I think that in the beginning we really study the problem in a very rational and logical way. We break it apart. We research it. We find other precedents for how the project might be approached so that we really understand the problem and maybe expand the problem as well. And it's only then that we can really think about who might come to the table and you have every project. Yeah, absolutely. So we were working with steel Cape America's largest commercial furniture, uh, dealer production house. And they wanted to create a new brand around handcraft called coalesce. And they were so astute in the idea of bringing the architect who was going to represent their brand in spatial arrangements to the table very early on.
Speaker 2 00:06:12 So we were within the conversations of how the brand could develop what its ethos was. And then I was asked to design spaces that would represent coalesce. So such a very interesting position for the architect to be in. So I decided to bring a series of people to at the very beginning of the project, including the client, of course, but I brought a filmmaker and a poet and a fine artist together at the table. And this is something that we do with many projects. We ask people to bring to the table, literally an object that represents what they imagine the project's ethos to be about.
Speaker 1 00:06:58 What was the design project when you bring those different perspectives together and how did you involve, how do you give them a voice to make your creative outcome? Mm-hmm <affirmative> more substantial
Speaker 2 00:07:14 Mm-hmm <affirmative> so they're the first people at the table with us and with the client as well. So there's a total transparency about this idea of interdisciplinary thinking, design thinking. And the overarching assignment was a flagship showroom, but we went so much deeper than that, to the idea of living with beautiful objects of how we work every day and how we could shift the ethos of how one works in what kind of spaces do they work with? What kind of tools do they work? And the poets and the filmmakers were so expressive in a way, probably different than we would think about it as an architect or the client would think about it as a producer of the product. So it allows you just to take a second suspend disbelief and take an adventure together. And does that process, does that workshop result in an answer day two? No, but it's food for thought and it resonates with us throughout the process. And ultimately always, there's never a question that some of that input becomes a part of the design concept, the execution, the material choices. It's really a celebration at the beginning of the assignment, the client, and this idea that all these creatives are coming together to really think about the problem on behalf of the client.
Speaker 1 00:08:54 We both know each other from San Diego and you, this summer finished a big project. The Mingue international museum, their mission is to celebrate human creativity and advance and understanding of art craft and design from around the world. And I was there, it's a beautiful museum. And, and you were the creative spirit behind for this big renovation. Tell me a little bit about the process where you started and I, I know you worked with the management team, you went on trips. So tell me a little bit about that beginning stage, and then how do you let that, uh, design project?
Speaker 2 00:09:37 Well, I'm so glad you brought this project up because it is recent. So I love talking about it, but it represents all the things that we believe in terms of creativity, collaboration, and the notion of how craft can really affect our personal lives. But the project began as a very simple to replace the floors in an existing museum, and to look at modernizing the lighting. And I sat down with team members and we talked about the fact that this was probably not an expansive enough brief to really allow the museum to have a voice, not only in our community, but globally. So we went to them and said, could we do a two, three months due diligence, uh, project where we really explore you? And there's an honor in doing that, you know, there's a gratitude for selecting us. And there's an honor in saying the client is the important person here, and we're not going to suppose to come up with a design solution without understand the true philosophy of the institution.
Speaker 2 00:10:51 So they agreed. And we went through a two to three month process where we interviewed all staff and board members and visitors and artists. And we basically articulated that the brief could be so expansive. Let's talk about you affect the ceiling and the floor you're affecting the walls and everything in between. So could we start looking at rearranging adding program and really emphasizing design craft and folk art to a level of perhaps even a transformation of the museum spaces themselves and their board was so courageous immediately said yes. And we started our adventure together. And at that point that we sit down and we think, okay, who are the players? Who are the people who I can bring to the table for a collaborative process? And ideally on a pro architectural project, there are 10 engineers, an acoustic person, a landscape architect immediately, you have 10 team members, maybe even 15, but beyond that, who could we bring?
Speaker 2 00:12:04 That's truly a creative mind. So I began to make a list literally at my desk of all the craft oriented artists in the world that I admired. And what came to us was this idea that my gosh, 80% of these are women really forging new ground for what craft is understood to be in the world. It's not just weaving a little potholder or <laugh>, you know, it's something so far beyond that, that we propose to the museum that we integrate these craft artists within the architectural project. So here's another collaboration that's so rich, maybe the Mo one of the most satisfying ever for me to have an artist integrate their work into the architecture. It's not a picture on the wall. It's literally a part of the building. And so that collaboration became a part of the whole and everybody was having just the most exciting and inspirational time together, including the management team of the museum.
Speaker 2 00:13:11 So I liken, and I think we've talked about this in the past, the job of the architect, let's call us the leader of the team to be the director of the film, where <affirmative>, where we know there's a whole slew of talent that we're bringing together to produce this beautiful thing and to respect each of those talents and bring out the best in each of them. And that is the way I felt about this project. Not only having the engineer be proud of what they're producing, but have the artist completely immersed in the process that we've created. So it's really a remarkable story.
Speaker 1 00:13:58 At the beginning, you took a trip to Europe with the managing director and the team. What was the purpose of that trip? And what did you learn that you could incorporate in that design architecture, transformational project
Speaker 2 00:14:14 As architects? We see, we observe, we're always looking, we're looking for inspiration and it comes from the most unlikely places. And I had a conversation with director Rob Seidner that perhaps we should travel and understand number one, what is the role of a museum in the 21st century? And it has shifted completely, but not only that, how could we observe the way museums operate, the way they sit in a city's context, urban context, how they communicate with the people around them, the city, around them, the world, and that there are so many practices of that, that observing it would allow us to formulate our own attitude about that. And so we traveled to Europe with a board member, Mo king, who was wonderfully inspirational to me to observe, to talk to museum people, to also experience culture beyond the museum context, because a museum has become so much more than a place to go and look at art.
Speaker 2 00:15:25 It's a social place it's gathering place. So these trips, although they didn't, again, result in immediate initiative, they're in the back of your head. And as a team, you're pulling them out as the moment is appropriate to say, well, what about that long bench we saw at the Berlin museum. It gathered people. It made people want to be there. Can we do that for ourselves at MGA? So the trips were critical because they also give you an aspiration that anything is possible. And we traveled to Europe, we traveled to New York, Massachusetts, where there are a lot of really forward thinking museums. There was just pleasure in absorbing information to almost bank it so that when you get together with these collaborative groups, you can share. And immediately there's just all of these ideas flying around the table and around the room. So it's like feeding yourself before you run the marathon.
Speaker 1 00:16:34 I really like that. You really challenge some of the fundamental questions. What is the purpose of a museum in the 21st century? What are we trying to bring to our audience? Looking back, I went to the museum and there's a social arena below at the first level. On the top level, there are beautiful patios. There is a wonderful library. Can you describe a little bit the spirit of this museum of the 21st century
Speaker 2 00:17:08 It's welcoming, it's opening to community. It's not her medically sealed. It's not a encyclopedic context. It's more a context of come in, enjoy yourself with your family and friends, be social, um, have a meal in the restaurant shop in the beautiful museum of craft. Shop, enjoy a coffee at the cafe, and then dive into this international collection of objects of everyday use that are crafted by sometimes unknown artists and allow yourself to put yourself in the context of the history of those pieces and how your world has evolved around that and how the contemporary digital world can embrace the handmade. And what's the conversation between those two things. It's a very special museum in that way that although it focuses on the hand and handmade object, it, it doesn't deny the fact that we are living in a digital era. And so this sort of generosity of welcoming, it removes all anxiety about what it is to go to a museum.
Speaker 2 00:18:31 And it puts you in a comfortable place to just simply intimately absorb the information and feel a part of it. Like you are an integral part of history. And I, I think the fact that the library is on the gallery level and open to everyone to go in peruse 5,000 volumes about art and design, sit down at a beautifully handcrafted table by George Naima in the 1950s, and really just allow yourself the time to be creative, to be inspired. And I think this is the difference between a museum of the 19th or even earliest 20th century when it was about collecting things from around the world that you normally wouldn't have the opportunity to see, but in a very controlled and serious environment in this case, the Plaza level, as you said, is open and energized and it's immediately disarming. It just says, okay, be here, be comfortable. And then go up to the quiet and intimate galleries, the library, the terraces, which allow you a view of BAA park, which is quite exceptional and, and really just be Zen, really absorb, and then come back to the Plaza level, which is energized and say, I have a place in this community. I have a place in this world. It's just a powerful, generous gesture by miny.
Speaker 1 00:20:12 And it supports their mission, which is also to foster and inspire creativity in each of us.
Speaker 2 00:20:20 Correct? Correct. I mean, I think there's so many times during the process where I would have called the director on a Sunday morning and said, I'm out of ideas. Could we go to the collection room and open the drawers and let me see. And he would tell me these immensely fascinating stories, and I would leave, ready to take on the next phase of the project. And I, I feel like that's what we want Menge to do for all of our community and all of the visitors. And there's a collaborative spirit about that, a teamwork spirit, where you're really working with your client, not for them with them. And it's essential when you're doing something radical. And you're trying to convince a group to take risk. If you engage them in the process, they have equal ownership to the effort. And that's the only way that new things happen. I think
Speaker 1 00:21:29 I had a chance to work with the management team and we did some leadership workshops and they had a big hurdle and they had to raise dozens of millions of dollars. And the challenge they had is can we do this? It was existential. And what helped them is that believe in their vision, believe in that new transformative place. And that was like an engine. It was the fuel that kept them going. And now they're short before the finishing line to what have raised 55 million,
Speaker 2 00:22:05 Yes, a tiny institution that was running on a very strict budget. But I have to say beloved in the city as a truly humble and thoughtful group, it was that spirit that we brought forward to all of the donors that we were gonna exemplify that humbleness and that authenticity through this opening of the doors, literally opening of the doors to invite people in.
Speaker 1 00:22:37 When you go upstairs there, you have special stones on the stairs. Mm-hmm <affirmative> where do those come from? And how did you happen to get them from Europe?
Speaker 2 00:22:50 <laugh> well, generally let me start by saying generally, because of that ethos of authenticity, we wanted to work with craftspeople and materials that came from generations of tradition of making. So everybody, every material was sourced from a company, a family, a group who had four generations honed their craft. So the stone is one great example. And just because you are Swiss, I decided to go to Switzerland, <laugh>
Speaker 1 00:23:25 <laugh> feel honored.
Speaker 2 00:23:28 So I'm gonna say it was 2005. I took a trip to Switzerland with a friend to ski, and we went to a very tiny town called vs in a valley between two mountains. And there is a quarry there that makes that quarry stone called vals quartz. And there is a spa there that is a hundred percent made of this stone. And you swim through the rooms and there's stone everywhere. And it was like one of the most phenomenal experiences of my architectural, uh, career. So fast forward to 2015, that memory comes forward. And I say, that's a material and an ethos about materiality that I want to explore with the museum. So it's a family run business, four generations deep, and we've worked so closely with them to bring the stone here, to carve it, to sculpt it in so many different ways, but there's a pride in that. There's a pride in supporting them. There's a pride for them to be involved in a project in California. And there's just a real celebration around let's call that a collaboration again.
Speaker 1 00:24:51 Wonderful. Any major challenges that you were facing in this process and how do you deal with diversity and obstacles? Yeah,
Speaker 2 00:25:02 I think we imagine that the project, because it's in a historic district and we were affecting the building, that there would be resistance to that because preservationists often don't wanna see any change at all. But I think that we developed a narrative, a story that was so strong and so authentic that everyone we encountered from a governmental agency point of view, as much as it took years to go through embraced the idea. So for me, narrative and tell storytelling is critical where the challenges can arise, especially in the architectural profession is that you conceive and you document in drawing form, and then it's handed over to the general contractor and they haven't been a part of that story. They haven't been your collaborator yet.
Speaker 2 00:25:58 And there's a lot of animosity at the beginning of that partnership because there's a sense of who's gonna win. And I never really understand that. But my philosophy about it is if each one of those people, who's building something on the job site can come along with you as their collaborator, then they will put their entire energy and talent into the product. And they will be proud at the end, even if they're a naysayer at the beginning. So we tell the stories to each person who's building something because they need to know that they're a part of this collaboration too. And that happened. There was a lot of doubt at the beginning. The general contractor was probably more versed in commercial building. And so were most of the sub subcontractors. But by telling these stories and allowing people to understand the worth, the value of what they were involved with and the result at the end would be celebratory. And for community, everyone became dedicated to it. And so our process is so complicated because it goes from one hand to another hand. And yet somehow the whole process came together as a collaborative effort through storytelling and allowing people to have an authoritative voice. They are the author of the project. And I think that applies to just about anything that one can do. Everyone needs to understand their place and why they're there.
Speaker 1 00:27:49 I heard this, uh, quote from a, a movie direct. He said, when I work with actors, I make them feel like the movie wouldn't be a hit without them being involved. Mm-hmm <affirmative> absolutely. So every actor who is in that movie feels like the movie's great because of me.
Speaker 2 00:28:09 Exactly. And, you know, we had the challenge of building during COVID, which was so difficult, the lockdowns, and it was especially difficult to keep morale, but this idea of crafting of making something very special, that was specifically detailed and very intimate, I think kept everyone engaged.
Speaker 1 00:28:32 You have this unique skillset and expertise to lead those design projects and make those beautiful places come to reality. When you look back in your career, what were some of the elements that the stages of your career that help you to, to be where you are today?
Speaker 2 00:28:59 The architectural education is tough. I, it could even be tougher than the medical education. And, and there's a reason I think for that is that when you're pushed out into the real world, you have a lot of doubters. You have to convince the world that your ideas are worthy. And so we had to do that during our education, in our design studios all the time. And so it's, how do you narrate your idea at its highest level of strength and how do you bring people along with the idea and how do you strengthen the idea itself? And when you have to present your idea, sometimes you listen to yourself and think, oh, that's not convincing <laugh>. So you've really got to tell a story, write a story, be a novel writer in a sense fiction, novel or reality. So I think it starts at that educational.
Speaker 2 00:29:57 And then you realize you have patrons people who are hiring you as their clients to do a specific thing, to make a specific thing. But for me, I always bring the client along with us. And that I think is it breaks down the challenges of any kind of doubt, because once again, they're a part of your process. So at the very beginning of every pro particularly residential projects, we ask our clients if they could do an assignment for us, and sometimes that's pretty surprising, but we ask them to articulate the essence of what think this is about through some creative medium, they could write, they could draw, they could photograph, they could share music. And I have a book set aside of all those wonderful things that have graciously shared with us, but they help us to move forward. Because then we understand the inner workings of our patrons, mind and intentions.
Speaker 2 00:31:08 We don't leave anything to chance or guess there's no guesswork involved with what we do. And so that goes back to logic. We really study the problem before attacking it at MGA. It was a year and a half of study before we literally drew the first line. And the first line was right, because we had done so much research ahead of time. There are, I think like any artist, there are challenges of being critique ultimately criticized, but you have to have the strength of the fortitude to believe in what you're doing and bring it forward to the table anyway. And I think that nay saying is probably some of the most difficult things that I've dealt with is because we don't approach any problem from a predictable point of view. It's always challenging in a very exciting way. And ultimately the right patron is gonna come forward and embrace that the global economics is a big challenge. So often projects have to shift because projects take a long time, 5, 7, 10 years, and the world changes as you go along. And so how do you shift the project to meet the change and be open to that shift as well? So I, I think the architect has a lot of strong challenges to deal with, but those are the things that make me the happiest that, that we have to really think hard.
Speaker 1 00:32:49 There's a lot of parallels to a business and architect can be considered a business as well with a lot of creative insight. And that essence, what is the essence of what we wanna build and how important it is to have clarity around that.
Speaker 2 00:33:04 Mm-hmm
Speaker 1 00:33:05 <affirmative> I was thinking about how could we use a, a process like yours to help my clients, to creatively express what they wanna create as a company or as a team.
Speaker 2 00:33:20 I will give you one great example of that, that I think you're absolutely right. I think the architectural education is something to look deeply into from other disciplines and perspectives. And Stanford university is doing so much of that. In, in these classes, they call design thinking and there's a Institute for design. And none of that is about design. It's about thinking about the tech world or the business world. And they acknowledge that the design thinking is important. So it was 2010 and the recession was happening and my business dropped 95%. And you were there to guide me through that pain. But I interacted with two other designers who were in the same boat. And we developed a series of workshops around design empathy, and the empathy of making things for the world. And we went to general electric healthcare, an unlikely partner, and they immediately said, yes.
Speaker 2 00:34:37 And we spent a year working on workshops all over the world with their healthcare executives, designers, production people about what they are doing is so centered around empathy for patients, empathy, for doctors. And it was completely separate from my active building as an architect, but it was more about how we think about a problem and how could that apply to a different kind of business. And it was a very successful thing. And during the recession, there was not much more satisfaction that one could have than to be contributing in that way. So I do think that the education and the process of thinking through a very long term problem is applicable to other businesses. And also, I mean, I have to say one of the reasons I began working with you is that you work in a different realm on a regular base. You're working with business people.
Speaker 2 00:35:47 I'm not calling architecture of business at all. It's a passion, it's, it's a lifestyle, it's so many things, but that you could bring that knowledge to me about team building and strategizing is, is critical. So I, I think that cross pollinization of information is something we need. We need so much all of us in our lives, in our work, and we need to be open to it. So although on some level we might be seen as artsy artsy architects, the truth is we have a very rational way of thinking through a problem. And I think there's something to share. There.
Speaker 1 00:36:31 You were a visiting faculty at Stanford mm-hmm <affirmative> <inaudible> what did you learn from the students teaching them about design?
Speaker 2 00:36:43 It was fascinating because it was in the civil engineering school and teaching them about architecture because civil engineers have to work with architects. Well, don't always have to, but they do. And so every student came to the table in the first day of studio with an incredibly rational point of view about the land, about earth, about how one calculates, what one does. And I was forced to respect that, which I do, but then open up their minds to a sense of wonder narrative stories, history, family. And there's a lot of resistance to that at the beginning, but I was so impressed. And obviously there are a lot of intelligent people on that campus and it was a glorious place to be. But by the end, they were overjoyed to tell their own story within the context of the project at the same time as calculating it very precisely. So architecture is this combination between poetics and science. That's the way I see it. And Stanford couldn't have been a better place to really experiment with that. Nevermind the fact that it's a beautiful campus architecturally and the landscape is astounding. And I think the students truly appreciate that there, no matter what discipline they're in. So it's a wonderful context for that conversation,
Speaker 1 00:38:20 Who is your idol and the person that massively influenced your thinking and your creativity.
Speaker 2 00:38:32 I was thinking about this because I knew you were gonna ask number one, I think it's so important to have a mentor in your early career. And I try to mentor others. Now that I'm a little older <laugh> who
Speaker 1 00:38:43 Was your mentor early
Speaker 2 00:38:44 On in your career? My, my mentor was a woman named Martha Schwartz. She had an art degree and went back to graduate school at Harvard to become a landscape architect. And I'll never forget. I was in my first job in Miami and she walked into the office and asked if she could make a presentation that no one really seemed to have time for her. I said, I will do it. And I was 23 at the time. And she presented this view of art and landscape, which completely blew my mind away. And I immediately hired her for one of our projects and she and I spent years working together. She inspired me in the sense that she said, don't look at each discipline as separate, think about how they can interact with each other. And we have, since there's a full circle story between us also because she became a friend and then she, again, she was my mentor at Harvard when I went to graduate school and really guided me through this idea of studying architecture and landscape together. And we have worked on projects together since. So there's a lovely, full circle story there, but it's somebody asking you to look at your discipline in ways you never thought imaginable. And I am so appreciative of her influence on me.
Speaker 1 00:40:16 Any other idol?
Speaker 2 00:40:18 Yeah. So Billy SI who's an architect in, um, New York and her husband, Todd Williams, but she came to give a lecture at my university early on when she was quite young. And I remember that it, it really struck me to the core and I had the courage at one point, although I'm quite shy as a person, I had the courage to call her many years later in New York and ask if we could just meet and talk and that talking and conversation has gone on for 20 years. And just recently, I actually commissioned her to do a piece at MGA for us. And that's just another beautiful, full circle story of a mentor, guiding a talent, and then the talent engaging and collaborating with the mentor. And she and Todd are building the Obama center presidential center. They do work all over the world. They are not only my mentors, but my inspiration. There's a humbleness to their work that I aspire to in mind. So once again, two, well, two again, really strong women.
Speaker 1 00:41:37 How do you describe your true calling?
Speaker 2 00:41:40 I always had a background in art and math and science, and I think my true calling is to bring all those things together, to create spaces that are humane, beautiful, that celebrate the craft of making and that touch people to the core. When you walk into Notre Dame, cathedral in France, well, hopefully when it opens again, I know I moved to tears. There's no explanation for why that happens other than there's a sense of scale and materiality and light. And I really aspire to touching people with the spaces that we create.
Speaker 1 00:42:27 What is a place that you created to help create that you're most proud of besides Mingue museum mm-hmm <affirmative> when you look back and say, wow, what we did is exceptional and the people living there or visiting there, they continue to admire and adore that place.
Speaker 2 00:42:50 So many answers to this question on so many levels, we make very private spaces and the idea of making a home for a newly out gay couple who wanted to celebrate and describe their relationship together within the context of an architectural project was a joy for me. But I think that leads to this idea that if I can bring joy to my patron and they can immersed in that space in their living lives every second of the day, that makes me so happy. Another level of that satisfaction comes from making public spaces and restaurants in particular, where I am giddy at the idea of sitting in the corner with my cup of coffee or my meal, and watching people with their wonderment about the space that they're in, that I've created a truly socially engaging thing. And so Mingue represents so much of that because all of those elements are there. I call it a big house, really, as opposed to a museum that it's a place where people can be happy and it's not very complicated, right? One of the doses walked in at the beginning when we opened the building and she just came up to me and cried. Not that I want everyone to cry our work, but the idea that you could bring a level of joy to others is so important
Speaker 1 00:44:38 With all your experience, you know, so much more now than at early of your career. What the advice that the experience senior Jennifer would give to the young aspiring you <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:44:57 Well, I hope I'm still telling myself lessons in 20 years from now, but I think to persevere with what you believe in and to not waiver, to not compromise and that's hard and you will suffer because of it. Yeah. Financially, or, but to drive yourself to doing the things you really believe in,
Speaker 1 00:45:19 How do you stay true to yourself, to your authentic self and to that belief that we all know inside when we listen to it, is there, how do you do that? What are some practices that you,
Speaker 2 00:45:32 Yeah, I think number one, architects have patrons. So selecting a patron that, or accepting work from patrons that believe in the same kinds of things that you do so that you're already furthering the work to begin with, but always checking with yourself throughout the process. Are you maintaining a strength of the message that you began with? Because a long process requires a lot of negotiation and compromise and right before we do that kind of negotiation or kind of compromise, we sit down and say, what is it we really believe in about this project and how do we stick to our belief system in honor of our client? Not just for us, it's not about our ego. It's about creating the a as perfect a project as we can, that is expressive of the beliefs of our client. So, so there are long arduous moments in this process, and you really have to sit back and reiterate to yourself what the strengths are and why you must persevere
Speaker 1 00:46:53 Mm-hmm <affirmative> and stick with those values and, and knowing the values and keep them upfront and not Weaver.
Speaker 2 00:47:05 Right?
Speaker 1 00:47:06 Jennifer, thank you so much for this conversation. It's been a great pleasure. If we wanna find out more about the work you have done your creative process, where do we find you?
Speaker 2 00:47:19 Our website is Lu studio.com. We are also on Instagram as Lu a studio, and I have my own Instagram, Jennifer and Lu, where I collect things that I think are beautiful in the world. Beauty matters come to San Diego and see much of the work there. We've also done a lot of work in New York, Chicago, Detroit, many opportunities to experience the work, which I think is one of the most important things that we can offer is experience. And thank you, Simon. Our conversations are always spirited and always right on the nose. <laugh>, that's what I love you.
Speaker 1 00:48:01 Thank you, Jennifer. Very grateful for our partnership and thank you.
Speaker 2 00:48:08 Okay. Be well.
